Person & Work of the Holy Spirit
Randy Peterman · Mar 17, 2013
Holy Spirit (2013), No. 10
Holly Hills Bible Church
https://www.hollyhillsbiblechurch.org/teaching/messages/4926346245059

Transcribed from the recording by SermonAudio, so expect the occasional misheard word.

Alright, well I've been preparing for this lesson for three weeks. Let's hope I can do due diligence. What do you mean by that? That was not a jab at Courtney who actually was covering for me for the last time that I was scheduled to teach. It's just been a little long. The good news is that actually I'll be out of town next weekend so if I don't finish this morning someone's going to have to cover for me. It will probably be Courtney.

We've made some good progress through the book, but we're going at a slow pace. Does everybody feel like we're racing anyways? How long is this course going to be? At this point in time we're hoping for the rapture any moment now. But the truth of the matter is that we're taking our time because we want to make sure that everybody feels comfortable with the material and what we're going through.

There's no point in racing through this and then when we're done you come back around and go, why didn't somebody tell me this? you stumble upon the material again or take the class and go, oh, they did tell me this, but we were moving too fast and I didn't pick up on it. So we're going to pick up here with question one. Does everybody have the questions? This is lesson five. Everybody's got the questions? Cool.

So the first question that we've got on here is, in John 1, 11-13, what does belief in Christ constitute? The best thing we can do is open our Bibles to John 1, 11-13 and read that. Now the good news is that some of you have a head start on this. You were here last week in the main service. Anyone remember why that's relevant? This is being born of God? By God's working? My dad covered this exact passage last week during the main service. I was kind of relieved that I didn't teach and start with this last week. I thought, man, he's just like his dad. He just copied that.

So, John 1, 11-13 says, He came to His own, and those who were His own did not receive Him. But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

So the question again is, what does belief in Christ constitute? New birth. The right to become children of God. So, the right to become children of God, new birth, those are all good. Born of God, good solid answers, born of God. Now, we have two parties that are in this, well three parties if we're considering God's position as well. We have God and His work through His Son, and who else? Who are the other two parties in this passage? Holy Spirit. Okay, so the Trinity is involved, but who are the other two parties? Us. Us and who else? Jews. Jews.

So those who believed and those who didn't believe. And the nation of Israel rejected him, right? The whole nation rejected Christ. Hopefully everybody is confident in that. That's why we are here as the church today. But his own did not receive him, but as many as did receive him. And that's where we get into people who believe in Christ as the Messiah. To them, he gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in his name. who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. So what does this new birth constitute according to John chapter 1? So he came unto his own means that he came to the Jews, right? To Israel, yes. I'm sorry, what was your question? What does this new birth constitute according to this passage? What were they born of? They were born of God. Verse 13 is the focus. They were born not of blood, so it wasn't a descent of parents. This is not from Adam.

I learned a really important theological word from Mike, and that is federal headship. This is an important word. It has nothing to do with the federal government, but there's a relationship there. Federal headship has to do with a representative man.

And we could go to Romans 5 and find more passages, more context on that. But if we were just born of man and there was a new man that was pretty good, would that be adequate? What did we need to be born of? According to this verse here. Well, what does this verse say? You're answering the right word for the class name, but what does the verse say? Wouldn't the not born of the blood or born out of blood, wouldn't that mean more Jewish people? Like born into, you know, being Jewish?

Well, this would be... Like would the flesh be Adam? Well, he's talking about people who received by faith. so it's in contrast to blood it wouldn't be Adam or we couldn't it couldn't be done by just blood by itself because Adam would always be the representative male. Right but I was thinking blood like bloodline like family like Jewish.

Well and the thing is that yes if it were just Israel that would be the case. That would be actually an interesting Theoretical problem would be to pursue what would happen if God had purified some man instead of sending his son. And then just the descendants of that man were pure in some way. That would be the only way that by blood that would make any sense.

And then none of us could be saved. Because we wouldn't be descendants. So blood wasn't the answer. It was the will of God. Yeah, it wasn't the will of man or flesh. It was but of God. So we're born of God. And that is fundamentally one of the things that... Well, we're going to get into it some more. But let's just say that legalism has no answer for being born of God.

If it's something that you do, if it's something that you could have done by the will of the flesh, that would be inadequate. Right? That's right. Because your will could change. We had nothing to do with it. Yeah, it was definitely by God. So the belief concept, were you going to say something? That word become the sons? Yes. That word is ginomai, which is to come into being.

So this becoming the sons of God is actually becoming something you never were before. by, you know, you didn't change political parties, you came into an existence that never was before for human beings. What were we before that? We were sons of Adam. That's the federal headship concept is that we were under Adam, he was our representative until we became believers and then we had to be born of God and rebirthed through Christ.

We're going to get into John 3.16 in a few minutes. I'm not going to go there. I'll wait for you.

John 3.16 is probably, at least for me growing up, one of the most misunderstood passages because I always went there as a gospel reference and letting people know that God loved them, but I didn't have any theological context for what Christ was doing when he was speaking to Nicodemus. So we'll get into that with the next question.

Any other thoughts on this constitution? Jack? You know, your father did a wonderful job last Sunday on this very thing, and I noticed he didn't use the Greek word for life, which is zoi. Is that what we're talking about here now, as far as that new life is concerned? Well, that's not here. The word for life isn't here and I think that's probably why he didn't use it. But we're talking about... But that's what it's about. Well, yeah, but that's why he wouldn't use that word to answer that part of your question.

But we're talking about the new life which is from God and it's the... And it's joy. It could be. It depends on where you're reading. But yeah, the new life is part of this and we're going to get into that. That's the main thrust of this lesson. So we'll get into that more.

I think one thing that I think I gleaned out of this is that even though it's obvious, it's like God literally did something to each of us. Literally something happened. He literally transformed us. It's a very personal change. And I think that one of the things that I find myself coming back to as a believer, as much as I grow and as much as I know, there is something about that personal understanding of change that is humbling over and over again.

Wow, this is me, he's talking about us. Which also makes it easier to have a greater sense of trust and intimacy in the body if you think about it. These are other people that he also did this to. And you can develop relationships in the church because of that. And that's really a cool opportunity as well. Randy, this also, you know, Mike reminded me, when you say the new change, this again, you know, everything falls into place. These are one of those verses if you, again, don't understand really the identification truths. You're almost like Nicodemus. What do you mean rebirth? What do you mean?

We're going to go into that with this next question. We're going to read John 3, 1-6. That's that discussion getting started. We really need to dig into that. We might as well do it right now. The next question is who must do the new birthing? John chapter 1 says that God chose to do it, but who's the one that's actively doing it? So let's turn to John 3 and look at verses 1 through 6. And I'll go ahead and read these out loud, but pay attention here. Now there was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, the ruler of the Jews.

This man came to Jesus by night and said to him, Rabbi, we know that you have come from God as a teacher, for no one can do these signs that you do unless God is with him. Jesus answered and said to him, Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. Nicodemus said to him, How can a man be born when he is old? He cannot enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born, can he? Jesus answered, Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Alright, so the trick question, it's not really a trick question, is who does the new birth? It's too easy, the Spirit of God. The Spirit of God does it. And why must the Spirit of God do it, according to this passage? Because it is inhumanly possible. Alright. There's a hole in what man perceives without the Spirit, isn't there? And it seems like the Spirit, like one of the things of the Spirit, is the Spirit, the Holy Spirit has the power. That full out power to do it.

The role of the Spirit in the Trinity is very active in the lives of humans. His agency in the lives of humans is presented at least scripturally in a unique way. And we could go to 2nd Corinthians and see, which one is it? 1st Corinthians 2 where the Holy Spirit knows the heart of God and the heart of man. The Holy Spirit has that. function within the Trinity involving human beings to be the uniter, to be the one that wounds us. So it's got to be the Holy Spirit. Why is it that Nicodemus didn't understand what Jesus was saying here? Well, that's true.

Why would it be foreign for the Jews at this time? They had a different system of achieving nearness to God. How did the Jews perceive the law at that point in time? What was the purpose of the law to the Jew at this time of Christ? If they kept it, they'd be blessed. They felt like if they kept it, they'd be blessed. But if they were honest with themselves, they already knew that they hadn't taken the land. They already knew that those things that the law prescribed, they were hedging on.

That's why when Joseph went to divorce Mary, he went to the court that was the quiet, put her away so that she won't be stoned to death court. Because he had two court choices to go to. They'd abandoned the original intent for the law, and this is an important question that we should all know.

Convict of sin? It's called a schoolmaster's win area too. Alright, but what was God's purpose for the law? So that we know what sin is. Alright. These are good answers. So it wasn't for salvation. The law never saved. The law was to separate Israel from the rest of the nations so that they could be set aside under relationship with him. But they had to still believe. Otherwise you could do things on the external side of things and not be a true Jew. And Paul goes into that a little bit as well in various other places in Romans chapter 4.

Randy? Yeah? Was the mindset of the Jewish like Nicodemus? Didn't he already think he was in by virtue of being... Yeah, he was a Pharisee. I mean, he was one of the in guys. You didn't get to be a set or a... a Pharisee and be a ruler of the Jews and not be educated and not have some things that you knew. But Christ comes to him and Christ speaks to him out of the Old Testament and talks to him about things and says things about the Old Testament that the Jews had forgotten. They had ignored or forgotten. Probably a combination of the two.

And later on Christ talks to him about Moses and the serpent in verse 14. As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up. Was the serpent for everybody or was the serpent... Just the Jewish people and those that were part of their clan. But if you were bit by a snake and you were out in the wilderness, you would be saved by the serpent from the snake bite.

If you looked on that. But the offering was to all Israel, wasn't it? Yes. And so Moses got, you know, this reference to Moses, we see this and that's actually a really key detail. How many sins did Christ pay for? And Mike was, I think Mike was getting at that, or one of you two got at that in the last two weeks. Christ paid for all of them, but until you believe that payment is not, the transaction isn't done.

And so with this new birth and this concept of the Holy Spirit doing things, you have a rich set of doctrines, but there's a relationship that has to be formed. So that's the new birth. Mike? In order to be born anew, what's got to happen before that? You have to die. You have to die. And so if you look at Romans chapter 6 and the first few verses, It talks about the spirit baptizing us into Christ's death.

So this new birth is not something that gets added on to you. It's a death, burial, and resurrection to newness of life. And so it really does set you apart from all that was of the old into the new. And so I don't think, obviously identification truths hadn't been taught, nor were they they were only referred to in the Old Testament, but this born-again thing, you don't think about, well, does that just mean that I just go from one state of existence to another without having to die to the old one? I have to die to the old one to get into the new one. And so that's a critical aspect of The idea of being born anew. You have to leave what you were. The concept of death is really key and we're going to get into that. The next question. One more point I was going to make which you just asked.

The thing that condemns a person is not the fact that their sins haven't been paid for. The problem that every human being has is that they haven't died. And so they haven't been separated from their sin nature. And God did not save the sin nature, he condemned it. So if you happen to check out of this planet, identified with the sin nature, you're going where it goes, to condemnation. So that's the deal, and that's the real problem. It isn't your sins are attached to you and off you go. But the real condemnation is the fact that you're attached to the man who's been condemned.

So Mike, though, you said before you can be saved, you have to die. So how can you not die? How could you still be attached to this nature if you're saved? You can't. That's the whole point. You have to be identified to Christ's death, and that's the death that Mike's referring to. You have to die.

It's not that this flesh... Right, but how could it... If you died before you were born again, how could you... Like you said, afterwards the problem with humans is that we haven't died. So that's like saying that we haven't been saved. Okay, that's a position condition question. Positionally, it was a simultaneous transaction. You died and were born again, like that. And it's a positional truth. It's true of everyone who believes, Jew and Gentile. And for the Jews also that will enter into the kingdom, same thing.

Conditionally, you still have a sin nature, but you're just not attached to it or united to it anymore. So you couldn't go to hell, because that's conditional then, right? If you're not... Does it say died daily? Like, is that conditioned? Unto. Okay, so there...

There's a conditional element where Paul says that we need to put to death the members of our flesh, and that's a conditional element. He's saying because spiritually and positionally you're seated with Christ in the heavenlies, and it is true that you have died with Christ, it should be the logical conclusion that you would be putting to death the members of your body. The idea that reckoning is probably the simpler way to put that. Reckoning yourself dead, like Paul writes in Romans 6. But if you don't, you still have salvation and you still have eternal life. Yes. So there's a conditional aspect to this and that's probably the key of what you're getting at.

Randy, I know this is outside of what we're talking about, but I've always been... We never allow rabbit trails. I've often been confused by this verse 5. Okay. Except a man be born of water. We're actually going to get into that during this class. Can you wait a few minutes? Is that alright? I can wait an hour if you want me to. If a rapture happens between now and then, I apologize.

And then you'll know I didn't mean to. Yeah, you'll have it figured out. But we're going to get to that. The way I love, so I know that a class lesson is laid out properly when I can't get to the question before you're already asking it. And that has happened already twice in this class, so we're doing good. So the Holy Spirit must do the news birthing. If we're going to give a short answer to question two, that's the short answer. Go ahead, Holly.

What was your answer to why Jews would follow the law? Well, the Jews were following the law with the wrong motive. They didn't understand it was separation under relationship. They thought it was about blessing and about national identity and about being a descendant of Abraham and all kinds of other things. There's provisions in the law for having an outreach to the Gentiles to help the Gentiles have a deeper, well, not a deeper, relationship with God. there's provisions to bring the Gentiles into Israel. They were to basically be evangelizing and telling people, here's how you have a relationship with the God of the universe, much like we're called to do by the direction of the Holy Spirit, to be evangelists at times, or not evangelists, to evangelize at times. But Israel neglected that. They read the parts of the law that said you must be separate, and forgot about the rest of it. Unless there's money involved. They were good traders.

And I don't mean that to say stereotypes, but it's a historically accurate statement. So then the reason for the law... Oh, what's the reason for the law? Yeah, to have relationship with... It was to separate the nation unto God. It was to bring them and draw them to Him because they would know that the only way they could ever satisfy their need for a God was to pursue the relationship that he had established for them in the law. That relationship aspect is something that we miss in the law because we read too many things about sacrifices and certain kinds of bodily fluids and the home on the arms and you can't eat this animal. We get distracted about the relationship aspect. And then part of the relationship is to realize that without God you can't fulfill the law and so then the relationship part is turned into God? The problem is in Israel you have to believe to be saved whether you're obeying the law or not.

David is a great example of somebody who... You would need multiple hands to count the recorded in scripture sins that David committed. If you just had two you'd run short. And some of them were real humdingers and yet still said that David was a man after God's own heart.

He was under the law, wasn't he? But what made him righteous before God? Was it the law? He recognized what he was. Well, he believed. He believed that God was his righteousness and that God would provide him. If you read the Psalms, it's very evident that David understood things about God that it seems like the people around him didn't fully grasp.

But the law was for a relationship. Could you say that they were like we trying to fix up the old man? Well yeah, they'd abandoned what the revelation was. We get distracted by the rules and the law and misunderstand the purpose. And Israel had done the same thing. It was way better to say I'm righteous of my own accord than to actually have to call on God's grace, right?

That's sarcasm in case the recording doesn't... Let's move to the next question because we're getting into some good meaty stuff here. Is it possible to see spiritual things before new birth? And if we look at the passage we just read in John 3, we should have an answer to that. Yes. You just said it, David. Did I? Let's take a look. This is a sticky wicket here. It is. Let's talk about it.

That verse 3 says, except a man be born, he can't see the kingdom of God. So the kingdom of God would be spiritual things, wouldn't it? That seems to be what Christ is saying. How about the Holy Spirit works before the new birth, but you don't see it?

Alright, so here's why this is a sticky wicket. You can't leave this classroom, I will lock the doors and not go lead worship after this. You can't leave until we understand this. This is that important. What was an Old Testament believer saved unto and how were they saved? The law never saved. Go ahead and say that again and say it louder. They were saved by faith in what God had revealed to them.

And had Christ died on the cross? No. So can the Holy Spirit still be involved? That's really another piece of this question. Can the Holy Spirit still be involved even though Christ hasn't died on the cross? Yes. So the Holy Spirit is involved in the Old Testament. In faith. We're all comfortable with that? Because this was shocking to me at one point in time in my life, so I just want to make sure we got that. The Holy Spirit is involved in all faith. The Holy Spirit is involved in all faith. So how does the Holy Spirit engage with an Old Testament saint? Like coming upon him for a specific enlightenment or service or something? Well the Holy Spirit has to woo that person and draw them in and they have to believe.

Abraham was presented with the truth of God's covenant. I will do this. But Abraham still had to believe. God was going to do it whether Abraham believed or not. The issue was, do you want a part of it? Yes, God was going to do things with Abraham despite his belief. That's the cool thing about a unilateral covenant. But Paul tells us in Romans chapter 4 that Abraham believed, and then it was counted to him as righteousness. But the Holy Spirit comes and woos him. So in this context, this is before Christ has died, buried, and been resurrected and ascended and is seated in the heavenlies, right?

So we have to understand that that's the context. We're not talking about Nicodemus becoming a Christian. Or a New Testament saint. That's probably a better way to describe that. But we still have the Holy Spirit. It has to be involved. He has to woo the Old Testament saint or the New Testament saint and they have to respond then. With what? Faith. So there's no tithing involved? Faith and tithing.

The thing is that the faith is the first step and then there's the logical conclusion that comes with the system that is in place, the dispensation that God has in place that comes as a result of that faith. But it's important that we recognize that the Holy Spirit is involved and it's impossible for the flesh to divine or understand spiritual truth. Can we all agree with that? Jesus said it. I hope we can agree with it. But what about, and then there's the what abouts, at least that come to my mind. The one that always comes to mind on this one is Romans 8, 6.

The mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the spirit of life is peace, because the mind set on flesh is hostile towards God. does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, and those who are in the flesh cannot believe God. So that does not mean, just in case anybody jumps to that conclusion, that we will subject ourselves to the law if we're saved. That's not what he's saying. He's just saying In this Romans 8 passage here, he's just saying that the flesh, of its own accord, will not satisfy God's law and it is hostile towards God's law. So what happened to Nicodemus? So what happened to Nicodemus? Well, I don't know. I do.

He was one of the guys that interceded for Christ's body. Oh, that's right. I know that, but I mean, True grace, you don't have to do anything. So he didn't have to go and bury him. Well, I think Nicodemus believed Christ. When Christ explained this to him, it's hard to believe that he didn't grasp at some point in time what would happen to not later come along and say, okay, we need to deal with this bond. You know, as we're talking, I'm thinking when the Spirit is working on a person who's lost, whether it be a Jew, or somebody today, I don't think he entices him with, well if you believe, here's what you get.

Because 1 Corinthians 2.9 says that the natural man cannot know the things of the Spirit of God, they're foolishness to him. So I think what the Spirit does, the first thing he does is he convicts. And he shows the person where they are in relationship to God. And then he gives them information, but they don't enter into it until they do in fact believe the information given.

They don't really get it, but they know that the thing they have to do is believe what is revealed to them, whether it's understood or not. There are so many facets to what you just said, because I think that when you understand that spiritual growth happens when you believe what is true of you, it makes learning and reading in God's word more exciting because you're learning what is true of you. And that's where the spiritual growth comes.

It doesn't come from like what I thought earlier in my life where I just need to go to seminary and memorize more facts. But it is sterile and devoid of some of the relationship aspects. And that could have been somewhat personal. I'm not saying that's true. Everybody's ever been to seminary. The reason I bring that up is because of the Calvinist viewpoint that in the total depravity of man that he must be regenerated before he can believe. And I don't, that's not true. Because just because of the verses we're covering here that he's presented with some facts and the natural man exercises faith and what has been presented to him before he's regenerated. Yeah. Courtney, do you happen to have this up on your computer? Which was the text of the book? Yeah.

Can you look for the sentence, it is only when men begin? Mike's brought up a point, and I actually wanted to draw this out later on, even though it's not directly related to one of the questions, but I'll do it because I think it's important. I just don't have the address in the book for this, but I'm going to read you a sentence, and they're going to use their computers to find it. It's on page 24. Okay, page 24. Midway down. Okay. This is a sentence out of here, and I thought it was one of the most It was something I'd learned earlier, actually from a friend during seminary, now that I've bashed seminary. But it was something I thought was really important.

It says, it is only when men begin to reason about God's truth that a haze falls over it. Does new birth precede faith or does it follow it? Such questions seek to separate what God has indissolubly joined together. But there are mysteries here none would question. There are whole systems of theology and man-made philosophies that go into what happens at the point of salvation, and the order. I've watched people spend hours arguing this, and yet scripture doesn't reveal it super explicitly, but it does reveal other things.

Last week, Holly shared this double-sided list of the 34 things that are true of the believer. I'm glad I don't need a stopwatch to go through, okay, I became a believer, and it's like, boom, right there at this fraction of a second, this truth was true of me, and then the next second later, this truth was true of me. Because of identification, it's true all at once. And I'm okay with that. And I'm okay with not knocking it down into smaller pieces.

But I think that's really important, that people get distracted by the order of salvation and what happened. Oh, God has to give you the faith to believe. No, the last act of of the flesh is to believe. Or I'm sorry, the last act of Adam is to believe.

And then what? He dies. And then he dies. That's really cool. I think that's actually a really phenomenal truth that not only can we see in scripture that death is required, but then there's a result after the death. And it happens when we believe. And this new birth is a major key part of that.

Well, where are we? Helen and I were discussing something. Now, where are we seated? You say we're seated with Christ. Yes, and let's find where that is in the Bible. When you hear those things, It's good to have a Bible address so that you don't just take Randy's word for it. Listen, I'm not hardly as holy as you might think I am. No, we don't think so. I said that with sarcasm. I'm glad you guys jumped on board.

I'm going to turn to Colossians 3, although other people may turn to other passages. This is my personal favorite place to go. Colossians 3, I'll start in verse 1. Therefore, if you have been raised up with Christ, keep seeking the things above, where Christ is seated at the right hand of God.

So that's Colossians 3.1. And then he continues on, so that we're not confused. He says, set your mind on things above, not on the things that are on earth. For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ and God. And Christ is ascended. You're hidden in Christ.

I believe that. It's just that I'd like to have a picture. I mean, I'm a visual therapist. This is an issue of position and condition. With Christ, actually, right now. Presently, today, right now. We are with Him. Correct. Our spirits and His spirits are inseparably entwined. But also the Holy Spirit is with us conditionally. Yes. He literally indwells us, right? He is literally indwelling us right now. He is transforming us, right, to that perfect Perfectness.

One thing that excites me on a personal level and gets me all worked up is to think about when either the rapture or my death comes, my position and my condition will no longer be separate. And I will be fully transformed and fully conformed and my position and condition will be one.

When you're actually dying. Like on your deathbed. As soon as I breathe my last breath and my heart beats its last Why do you think that Paul doesn't call it death, he calls it sleep? Yeah. Because you already died. Yeah. You've already been identified with Christ and his death. Another one is Ephesians 2, verse 4, but God being rich in mercy because of his great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ. Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus. Ephesians 2. Yeah, 2.6 is about the seeding. 2.4 through 6. Yeah, 4 through 6. And raised us up and seeded us with Him in the heavenly places.

So, just kind of on a practical spiritual level, wouldn't, as far as like a person who likes to visualize, wouldn't that be like a personal thing that maybe you'd want to, you know, pray for God to give you a really nice, comforting visual. There's like, you know, right? We have some diagrams that we've used in the past in different classes. I'll go ahead and I'll look those up and I'll bring them to you.

I think it's important to understand that the Spirit of God is not really about is about is revealing Christ to you. And as you behold him, you discover that you're in him and he's in you. And you talk about intimacy, there's where it is. And so the Spirit's job is always to reveal Christ to the believer. He in himself is what gives the soul rest.

Well, I don't mean exactly a picture. If we are seated with Christ and yet the Holy Spirit lives in us. You want to understand the relationship between the position and the condition? Is part of us seated with him and yet we're still here? Your life is hidden with Christ. The life of who you are, your eternal life, your spiritual life is hidden with Christ. Is that a little bit better?

That's what the Colossians passage says. I would say this too about that. When you look at Hebrews 11, 11-1 is the definition of faith. It's the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. But verse 2 says that by it the elders receive witness Which says to me that if the Spirit of God shows me like Colossians 3, then I am risen with Christ.

I'm seated with Him in the heavenlies. My responsibility is to believe Him. At some point, He will confirm in me that that is really what's true. My whole deal is just to believe Him. He told me that, so I trust Him. I believe Him. through the work of the Spirit over time, a settling down and a confirmation about the information I have that is in fact, I'm persuaded about it.

It's true. Of me. That's a good point. And that's partially why sanctification or the spiritual growth concept is something that's a progress and a process that takes time. Because I've watched Wayne. No, I'm just kidding. You had a question, Wayne? Well, I was just... Part of what we see is this physical old creation. So what she's saying, to distinguish between the two, we can't put ourselves physically sitting there in this old body, because this old body is not part of it.

And that's where the word identification has a lot of concepts wrapped into it. I think sometimes we throw it around Holly Hills because if you've been here for almost a decade now, there is a certain amount of, you get used to it, and things that I've learned, it's all packed in there. And we've done identification, how many times have you and you two taught identification? Four times. Four times, and secretly, and if we're being honest, every time, every class is always identification truths, it's just sometimes we call it that.

And the truth is that it's that critical to our understandings that this principle of being identified with Christ impacts every facet of our walks. There's not a doctrine that we can touch that doesn't somehow tie in with identification, even if it's a mirror opposite of what we're looking at. I think in Wanda's defense... Defense? You don't have to do it. I have several.

I'm just saying that the idea that my spirit that exists right inside of me is also in heaven is for Mike says you just have to believe it because the fact that they coexist. like maybe infinity away in heaven and in my heart, it just takes believing it, because how do you understand that concept? Because it's a mystery. Yeah, it comes back in faith. I always go back to these verses that don't make sense unless you understand the identification, what we call identification.

And it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me. The life which I now live in the flesh, I live by what faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself up for me. It's that. The transaction's been done. We have been crucified. And it's now, I think it's this position and condition. Question again, positionally.

The way I look at it, and I tried to explain this one time, and the best way I could come up with, When I got married, the best analogy I came up with is when my wife saw me at the wedding, she saw me as a fiancé, as a boyfriend, but once we were married, she never ever saw me again as a fiancé, as a boyfriend. She saw me as a husband now. That's all she can see me as now. Never again.

That's how he sees me, is in Christ. That's it. He never sees anything else but me in Christ. So positionally, where's Christ? He's right beside him. Okay, I like that. And so now, he sees me only in Christ. So when he sees Christ, he sees me. And where's Christ? Seated at the right hand. So positionally, that's where he sees us now. And then, but reverse it. So, but sometimes, maybe it doesn't Don't use the feeling word. So God always sees us in Christ, but we don't always see ourselves in Christ from the opposite way.

And that's the growth. And that's the reckoning and the beholding and those principles. So in other words, all of you people that belong to this church and some of us are just new coming here. You don't have a membership, you belong. I belong here. You've had all these others. This is like throwing you into a swimming pool and you don't know how to swim. That's what we do best. It's like Baywatch for Christians. I don't know where that came from.

But we should we should close in prayer. The truth is that we're all we're all growing in our understanding of these things that you're hearing some confidence from various folks. But my Courtney and I will and Mike alluded to this. We're still growing in our appropriation and our understanding of these things that are true. I've been teaching around here 25 years. And trust me, there's some people still swimming in the shallow end. I sometimes I feel like that's me. So I'm not talking about everybody that you're thinking of. It's me.

But as we look at this, I'm trying to see if I can outdo Courtney and how long it takes me to teach three questions. But, you know, Courtney did go one week without even doing one question. What we have here is some really important truths about. the new birth and as we continue on through the rest of this lesson it's going to be more and more depth on this concept of new birth and I'm excited about where it's going to go. I'm unfortunately going to be on vacation next week because we planned 13 months ago to go out of town so it's pretty well committed.

But I guess Mike said he's going to teach so that we can go through it quickly or something. But there's some good stuff here. Let's go ahead and close in prayer, and then we'll keep talking. If anybody does want a copy of the 34 things, I have one here, but we can make more copies of it for folks to hold onto. This is a trifold, so it fits away kind of nice.

Let's go ahead and end in closing prayer. continue throughout the time that we have here on this earth to impress these truths into our lives about who we are in you and about the new birth in this new eternal life that we get to be part of. We just ask that you would continue to bring the prayer requests that have already been mentioned to our minds throughout the week so we can lift one another up in prayer. And Lord, we thank you for this time. We praise you in Jesus' name. Amen. Only three questions. Is the meat in this book as we've been going through it?