Abstain from fleshly lusts

All right, good. I'm just giving me a tough one today. I don't think there is. It's all good. So we're kind of in a transitionary phase of first year here. And Roger was from your lesson last week. Thank you. Who's up next week? Actually, I am again. Roger's. Hey, excuse me. No, that's not the way you want to bring that across, is it?

OK, so today we're going to look at two verses, and we're just going to read two verses because these two verses kind of, in a sense, stand alone a bit. We know what preceded last week, and there will be some very interesting things to follow. But we're in verses 11 and 12 today. Beloved, I beg you as sojourners in pilgrims, abstain from fleshly lusts which war against the soul.

Having your conduct honorable among the Gentiles, that when they speak against you as evil-doers, They may, by your good works which they observe, glorify God in the day of his attention. This was a lot. This was fun, actually. There's a lot of meat here. And one week on two verses seems like plenty. But in fact, it may not be. So let's look at that first verse.

So this is by New King James in the Christ standard. love that beseech you rather than beg you. So here we see a shift in the identity of God's people in terms of the salvation message to their task in this unreceptive and hostile world in which they live. Welcome to the earthly existence. Don't get too comfortable here. That's really a message that Peter continues to bring across. Agapitos, notice the overzealous love and appeal to which he's approaching, to whomever he's writing. Really, it means to the dearest of friends.

These are blood brothers in the Lord Jesus Christ. So, who is Peter begging or beseeching here? Christians. Believers. I said believers. Believers. Mostly Jews, presumably? I think so. Because the Gentiles get brought up in this, you know, the next verse, the Gentiles get brought up. They're Jewish Christians, Jewish believers. Yes, I mean, the early church was mostly Jews, right? And Paul had a lot to do with the spread through the Asian nations to bring the gospel to the Gentile nations.

Why does he call them, or even us, remember the scriptures written as much for us today as it was to them, Why does he call them or us sojourners and pilgrims? Sojourners, strangers without citizenship. Interestingly enough, both sojourners and pilgrims here, pilgrims sojourning in a strange place, a foreigner, both of these terms in the Greek are adjectives, not nouns. So these are describing the people, those to whom Peter is writing. So what are these terms representing here? Sojourners and pilgrims. Believers. Hey, believers, I love you to death. By the way, you are sojourners and pilgrims. This is not our home.

I love Philippians 3.20, which is really kind of on the same theme. Paul writes, For our citizenship is in heaven, from which we also eagerly wait for the Savior. the Lord Jesus Christ. And I love a tie-in verse to this, Philippians 121 where Paul says, for me to live is Christ and die is gain. Either way you win, right? For me to live is Christ and die is gain.

And I honestly think, and this truth is so, so incredibly important as we live as refugees by faith in this foreign land. This ain't our home. And that kind of, in a sense, I think puts our trials and tribulations into appropriate perspective. It doesn't make them go away. But when you keep looking down, woe is me, woe is my dearest spouse, child, mother, father, whatever. If we look from heavenly places on our circumstances, where our citizenship really resides, things take on a different look. The circumstances are the same. God is not in the business of changing our circumstances, although he could. He's in the business of conforming us into the nature of his son. So Peter very appropriately is addressing his dearly beloved as sojourners and pilgrims. Profound truth. And I would suggest that, you know, this is a soft pillow for a tired head, realizing our citizenship's not here, that it's in heavenly places. Your thoughts about that?

Well, Bob, in the context of 1 Peter, this was in the time of Nero. And Nero wasn't the greatest friend of believers, right? He was bringing them in his garden for pleasure, for some weird pleasure. So it was a very difficult time for them. And we're going to see that as we get farther on. He says, keep your eyes fixed on things above.

If it's not your home, Al? I mean, do you all reflect on this periodically? I mean, charts and tribulations. Welcome to life, huh? I mean, things are going well sometimes for us, sometimes they're not. But I mean, that's an earthly perspective. From a heavenly perspective, there's no condemnation. We're fully accepted in the blood. We're risen with Him in newness of life. Where is He? Not here. He's living in us by the power of the Spirit. That life is revealed. But citizenship is incredibly important. And it personally helps me kind of put things into perspective when I get too woe is me in terms of the circumstances around me. Other thoughts about that? Other people think about this?

I'd like the sojourners and the pilgrims to ask. I'm sorry. When you said that they were agitates, not nouns, that was very interesting. I really like that. I think of it as we're crusaders or so. That's really right. These terms modify who we are. They're not identifying us as sojourners. We are described as sojourning, a modifier of who we are. All right.

Any other thoughts or questions about this sojourners and pilgrims aspect? All right. So this is really directed mostly to Jewish believers to whom Peter was mostly writing again. And these were very much like the great fathers of the faith. Remember In Hebrews 11, what's Hebrews 11 about? The historic exemplary pattern of people who live by faith.

In Hebrews 11.13, these all died in faith, meaning Old Testament saints. Not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off. and they were persuaded of them and embraced them and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. Goodness, what kind of promises would those have been? I mean, what did the nation of Israel look for in terms of the promises? Now, I'm talking about the nation of Israel. What was Israel looking for?

A king. A king. A land. Peace. serenity, lack of conflict, no war. And the Jew today, the believing Jew, is still looking for this, right? The promised land being fulfilled where there's rule and righteousness and honesty and all those attributes that God has promised in terms of the Millennial Kingdom, where the law will be written on their heart. But what about the men and women of faith described in Hebrews? They're looking for a promise. coming forward where they viewed their existence as simply being strangers and pilgrims on the earth. Neat. There is a view that these men and women had that went far beyond the circumstances in which they lived. That's what Peter is calling the believer to here.

Okay, the tough part of the lesson. Abstain from fleshy lust. I'm not in response to that. Are you kidding me? Give me a break here. All right, let's get into the title of the lesson, Abstain from Fleshing Lust. Hey, Roger, how come you picked this title? I don't know. All right, abstain. It's a precedent infinitive which reflects both purpose and now. This is active tense. Not tomorrow, abstain from fleshing lust, or sometime next week. How about this moment and every moment?

So this verb is used five other times in the New Testament. Three of these relate to sexual immorality. And if you like verses, we're not going to turn to these. Acts 15, 20, 29, and 1 Thessalonians 4, 3 look at abstaining from fleshly lusts. Abstain, the verb used in relationship to sexual immorality. One to every form of evil, which would include sexual immorality, but anyway, that's the first Thessalonians 5 passage. And then one to foods, abstain from foods offered to idols kind of deal. So that's another time where that verb is used. But four out of five would include sexual immorality. And what's fleshly?

It's that other nature, right? You know, that other nature is something that we all have. You know, when we come to be saved, we're saved from sin and saved from the power of sin and we're looked at as ones who have no condemnation. But yet, that old nature remains in each and every one of us.

I was in New York a week and a half ago and I was with a Jewish colleague who was at NYU, which is where I was. And he was describing a circumstance that had come up with a colleague a collaborator that he had shared a genetically modified mouse. Now you just have to accept this, in the area of science where we work, we make mice kind of do what we want by changing gene expression. So anyway, he had shared a mouse with a colleague at another institution who in fact claimed to be a man of faith. Now you can deal with that however you want, could have been a Hindu, a Buddhist, but I tended to sense that he was a Christian.

So what Ed told me was that this mouse was given to him in a collaborative manner so that the publications to follow would have been shared by the two investigators. Only this guy apparently took the mouse, did his own experiments and published without Ed's name being on the paper. So Ed said, Bob, you're a man of faith, right? He said, what's this all about?

And then the knock was on the door and I was being moved from his room to somebody else's room. I said, Ed, let's talk about this this evening because I went out to dinner with him that night with a number of other people. So here we are at dinner. Ed's sitting here, I'm here, and there's a woman from Columbia who's being recruited to NYU seated here who's Jewish. And so this conversation begins with her in the middle.

And so I kind of... I said, Lord, you opened this door here today. I didn't open this door. So how are we going to go through this by the power of the Spirit, I hope. So anyway, Ed's asking me again about the performance of this so-called believer. I said, first of all, I'm not sure what kind of faith this man has. So I really can't speak to where he's coming from. And he said, well, let's say he is a Christian. I said, well, look, Ed, I've got to take you through kind of biblical truth now. So this is what the Bible says. I said, first of all, let's start on the same page.

If Christ isn't risen from the dead, everything I'm going to say that the Bible says is worthless. I mean, today what we celebrate is incredibly the essence of Christianity. The Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of Man and the Son of God, crucified, buried, risen in newness of life. If he's not risen, we have no faith.

So we begin there. By the way, every time I have an opportunity to share with someone, this is the issue that I always start with. By the way, we're going to come to this in the lesson today, but Christ is a stumbling block to the Jew, but foolishness to the Gentile. So basically, if you're not going to deal with Christ as being risen from the dead, we have no conversation. So let me begin there. So we use that as a premise to go forward. And we went into this discussion about the flesh.

And ultimately it wasn't just for the belief that the sins were forgiven, but in fact God has told us that when we believe and have come to a saving relationship, we're one with God and we're declared righteous. Now that's not my rule, that's what he said, but it's all based on Christ being raised from the dead. And we talked a little bit more and he seemed to understand that this falling short of this colleague of his may not be that he's not a believer, not walking perfectly here, but in fact that the sin nature still exists in each and every one of us. And that's really so profound, isn't it, to an unbelieving world to let them know that we fall short from their expectations because we all have fleshly lusts.

We're from Christians who try to be good Christians. I'm sorry? It's also hard for people that are trying to do their spiritual push-ups to be good Christians. And there's nothing better than being transparent about this when we do fall short. Now we like to walk that walk of faith that always looks beautiful to everyone else, and that's in the next verse. We're going to get there too. But this fleshly lust is that other nature that still exists in each and every one of us. And when our faith is not at the right hand of God, where we're actually positioned, we fall short.

Galatians 5.19, now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these, adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, et al. And if you look at the next few verses, we have a whole list of these things. Again, notice the initial emphasis here on sexual lust.

Literally, when it says abstain, it means to hold yourself constantly back. Who's holding me back? That's the definition in the dictionary. This is incredibly a struggle that never ends. How are you doing here, by the way? It's a constant battleground, isn't it?

Now, I don't know whether sexual lust or immorality, which I think is really what is intended here mostly, is, I don't know whether that's more a guy thing than a gal thing, but it's a constant deal. Maybe it goes away with age, I don't think it does.

The point is, this is something that comes up frequently scripturally. And Peter's concerned about it enough to bring it up here. And it's something that we're all about. And the reason is that these fleshly lusts war against the soul. And war here is an active verb. The war is present and indicative. That means it's factual. The flesh will always war against our soul. Not only do these lusts impede, but in fact thinking of war and their attacking us. They attack us. So let's look at soul. Which of the following is modified from Thayer? I modified the Thayer definitions a little bit because I thought they were a little bit extensive and maybe not entirely clear.

Which of these do you like best? The soul is the seed of feelings, desires, affections, and aversions. The soul is the aspect of the human existence created by God that can attain its highest end and secure eternal blessedness as a moral being designed for everlasting life. view from heaven, that's what the soul is all about. Or it's an essence which differs from the body and is not dissolved by death, to be distinguished then from other body parts. Which of these do you like best? Maybe they all are essentially true. Anybody like one of these better than the other?

What if somebody asked you, what is the soul? How would you answer their inquiry. Where Christ dwells. So you like the second definition best. I always thought of the soul as the seat of mind, body and spirit. The first. You like the first one best. I like the third best. So we could talk all day long, couldn't we, about which one of these is most applicable. And they all are kind of correct.

Tom, which one do you like best? Let's hear the rest of the story. Tom is unwilling to make a commitment here at this point. Bob, you know, typically we'll talk about that we're body, soul, and spirit. But one of the things I struggled with over the years is that you look at the verses and soul and spirit are very, very If you do a search of all the verses that have soul and spirit, you'll find that there's an overlap between soul and spirit in there. we look at here at Holly Hill, soul is, you're soul-ish. It doesn't have a, necessarily doesn't have a positive aspect. It's not neutral. You would say the soul is not neutral.

It seems like, because of the verses that talk about soul-ishness, and it tends to be, whereas the spirit tends to be, you know, our spirit is one with God's spirit, and so soul, you know, that's kind of divided. It says actually that God's word can divide between the soul and spirit, so that's kind of another critical way to look at it. Soul is a big topic. But remember the verse that we're studying here. Beloved, I beg you as soldiers and pilgrims, abstain from fleshly lusts which war against the soul.

So could the soul be neutral? I always think of the soul as kind of neutral, influenced by the spirit, the Holy Spirit, or influenced by the flesh. In a sense, these definitions all encompass that broader definition. But when we think of soulish, we typically use that word in the negative, don't we?

Okay, let's go ahead. The victory over fleshly lust, what is it? It's the same victory we get over everything else that we deal with day in and day out. It's faith. Faith, faith, faith. You know, the harder, you know, when you look at none but the hungry heart every day, you realize that the more you struggle against your fleshly lusts, whether they be sexually driven or whatever, the more you get defeated.

There's just got to be a victory that goes beyond trying to work harder at dealing with these fleshly lusts. Romans 6, 11-13, likewise you also reckon yourself to be dead and need to sin, Mike dealt with this Friday night, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord. Therefore, do not let sin reign in your mortal body that you should obey it in its lusts. Do not present your members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin, but present yourselves to God as being alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God.

Powerful verses. The thing is, when you're faced with a fleshly lust, whether it be sexually driven or whatever, it's not like you turn on the light intellectually and say, gee, that's going to go away because I'm plugging into this verse. No, it's not that.

It's a faith that extends through this fleshly experience. When we live by faith, we put ourselves in a nature that is not the fleshly nature, and ultimately, that's the only way by faith that these things are conquered in our life. It seems when I fight against my fleshly lust, it's like introducing the law, which expands the desire for sin. So, yeah, the only way out is to trust my faith. And it goes back to the whole foundation of everything that we learn, right? Is that not I, but Christ in me? It's not our war against ourselves, it's the Lord fighting it through us. It's the Holy Spirit fighting for us. So in a sense to build on that, today's none but the hungry heart. How many read it today? Anybody read it today? Joanne did.

It's called Rags to Riches. But I see another law of my members warring against the law of my mind. These are not intellectual triumphs here of her fleshly lust. And bringing me into captivity of the law of sin which is in my members. Great point. So this morning's none but the hungry heart. Self is the believer's indwelling enemy. Its degrading bondage is as deep as heartache.

However, the reign of self is overthrown by its own enmity since it creates the needs that cause us to hunger for and appropriate Christ's life and liberty. A sense of spiritual poverty is necessary to spiritual growth. This awareness of failure becomes acute to the believer during those days when he or she is attempting to attain holiness of heart through self-effort. Knowing what he ought to be and do, he, she proceeds to try to reach these goals and purposes, resolves, promises, struggles, weeps, fails time and time again.

Their testimony with Paul is the things that I want to do I don't do and the things that I do not want to do I do. What a delightful day it is for us when we realize that in him that is in his flesh dwelleth no good thing. And only then does he in his failure cry out, who shall deliver me from the body of this death? And I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. He comes back to reply. And he begins to recognize that God expects only failure from the flesh, never success, that in Christ is his sanctification and his growth. Thus, it is that freedom that comes through bondage, life through death. Great. So applicable to what we're talking about here this morning. All right, good, let's move on. Second verse, verse 12.

Having your conduct honorable among the Gentiles. So again, remember these are mostly Jewish believers he's writing to. So the Gentiles is a whole different crop. That when they speak against you as evildoers, they may, by your good works which they observe, glorify God in the day of visitation. All right, notice the call to witnessing to the unsaved Gentile nations. So again, it really points to the fact that Peter is writing mostly to Jews. Honorable or Honest in the Greek speaks of goodness which is beautiful and outer goodness that strikes the eye.

And let me pause just here. I think when we measure people's performance through this perspective, we can really be misled. Like my colleague at NYU whose collaborator disappointed him by his, you know, really violating a relationship which was a covenant between the two. And Ed now thinks less of the Christian because of this. Hopefully the Lord met a little bit of that need when we had our conversation. Just like that, keep in mind that the unsaved world could have things happening around them to others that they're responsible for that looks better than what a believer might do.

So we don't want to be overly conclusive in just looking at these things, but yet as believers we're called to a conduct that's honorable and seen by others as bringing glory to God. Now, we don't measure that ourselves. I think, in fact, the life that we live in the Lord Jesus Christ is not something we personally pay attention to. It's a life lived by faith. And when that life is lived, we're not saying, gee, I had a good day today. I lived in the new nature. No, no, I don't think that's what we're talking about here. We're just saying a spirit-led life, which views our life and existence in heavenly shoes as the Spirit leads is really what we're talking about here.

And why didn't the Gentiles believe? We touched on this about 10 minutes ago. Why don't Jews believe? Joanne? They looked at the believer's way of life, which they were consistently holding to as their manner of life. It exposed their sin. They didn't like that.

They don't want to have anything to do with, to be responsible to God, I suppose. What does the Gentile typically carry with him or her in terms of a mindset of God? Let's say they say they're agnostic, there is a God, but then what is their relationship to God? It's based on their own works, right? There's none of this exchange life, identification truth that the Gentile world goes through.

Well, here we are. Good, Margaret. And I didn't tell her to say that. 1 Corinthians 1.23. Don't we preach Christ crucified to the Jews a stumbling block, but to the Greeks foolishness.

Now, it's interesting. This conversation I had with Ed, my colleague at NYU just a week and a half ago, I can't tell you how opportune I've had to have conversations with Jewish academic people. Probably five to six to one compared to the opportunity to share with a Gentile who's in the same space I'm in. And I consider it a real privilege. It's a humbling opportunity.

But the Jew seems to be able to discuss faith, whereas the Gentiles are all foolishness. There's no conversation here. I mean, the warden almost never opens up the door with a Gentile scientist or physician. Foolishness. And if they view it as foolishness, then what conversation do we have? Or as the Jew, Christ is a stumbling block. So it seems like we have a conversation. They just don't believe that Christ was the Messiah.

But they have a respect for the fact that I'm accepting of that truth. Tom? Lest we all give up on the Gentiles, you've got to remember, especially in this fellowship, that it was Al Molloy who was impressed, despite being about what a real Christian was like from his boss at work. Very good. And Hal's going to be brought up here shortly. Are you reading ahead here in the handout? Oh, OK.

So why would the Gentiles speak against newborn, mostly Jewish believers, as evildoers? Important question. Why are they accusing the church as being evildoers? Isn't that an oxymoron? I mean, I stumbled on this for a second. It didn't take me too long, I think, to figure this out. It ties in a little bit to what Joanne said. If you're a skeptic, believing that Christ is this whole Christianity thing creates an atmosphere of foolishness.

Why would you call them evil doers? Is it because they're worshiping a dead man? They think we're worshipping a devil. Superstition and all that stuff. That could be one reason. They still have a sin nature. They still sin. Maybe as a believer you're seen as an enemy against their way of life. Anything else?

Well, when they speak against you, the verb tense is present active indicative. That means they're going to speak against you. This is factual. It's not kind of if they speak against you. They, in fact, are speaking against you. And they're speaking now against you. It's fact. It's happening. Honorable conduct seen as evil. By what standards? Governmental? And maybe in the time of Nero, maybe this came up to some extent, that the government had its own rules and regulations. And here are this group of people that are really an antithesis to what human law was all about. Not that they were breaking the law, but they were probably looked at as an antithesis of Roman rule in some way.

Paul's reception at Thessalonica, and Roger will remember this, those who were in the class for Acts. So Paul's on his way down to Thessalonica to see what's going on down there. And the Jewish people there, who were unbelievers, ultimately were pretty critical of what they were seeing in this new thing called the church. And when they found them not, they drew Jason and certain brethren under the rulers of the city, crying, these that have turned the world upside down are come hither also. So this is the response of the unsaved Jew in Thessalonica when Paul, in fact, moved into that area to spread the gospel. So they're called, really, you know, they've turned the world upside down.

So in a sense, I think the church is called evildoers because they're kind of on a different path than what's accepted in the world system. Think of us today. Does the world look at, I don't know that the world looks at us as evildoers. Are we called evildoers as believers today? I don't think so, but we maybe are living in a world where there's not much, we think that we're being persecuted, but Thinking about Kenya this last week, oh, wasn't that a terrible, terrible sequence of events?

But there are people who have equated Christians as bad as the terrorists. Right. They're out there saying that right now. So we're talking about an ISIS-type view. We're discriminating against our children when we raise them up in the faith. Yes, okay. And actually saying that that's a form of abuse of your children. That's true. Spanking, for instance. Homeschooling, these kinds of things. Teaching in the Christian life. based on the human standard, right? The governmental standard. Let's look at the Lord Jesus Christ, and I think this is a really incredibly spectacular example.

John 18, 29, and 30. Pilate then went out to them and said, what accusation do you bring against this man? And they answered and said to him, if he were not an evildoer, we would not have delivered him up to you. Isn't that a tremendous verse? So when we think of identification of our walk by faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, we're evildoers.

You know, back in ancient times, Christians didn't worship the emperor. So they looked at Christians as anti-government. So back to kind of the Nero era that Roger mentioned, yes, I think that's really good. But don't you find a tremendous identification with this statement of the cross?

If we wasn't an evildoer, we would not have delivered. And why was Christ an evildoer in the mind of the Pharisees? Threatened by Him claiming to be the Son of God. I really, really was ministered to when I found this first here yesterday. So Bob, we shouldn't be surprised when we're called evil doers and in a way it's confirmation that we're in a way watching the Lord because if they view us as evil doers we're in good company. But in temporal context to be called an evil doer would make you think you're doing something wrong. I know and that's the thing that you have to kind of keep your head about you know if you know you're doing what if you believe you're doing what's right if you're doing wrong then you'll suffer the consequences and you should admit to that and pay the penalty. But if you're doing what's right, in fact there's a bunch of verses that talk about that, if you do what's right. If people perceive that as being evil doors, then you're in the company of Christ. That's what was talked about all through those chapters that Paul wrote.

The world is upside down. What's good is now perceived as bad. That's exactly where the world is today. I'm sure you think about believers that are in these countries, Syria, Libya, Saudi Arabia, Iran. What's happened to those believers? I'm sure they have been murdered. I'm sure many of them have been murdered. And we'll never know about those people. Because they hung on to their belief in Christ. Well, if you think of the Islamic view of the world, the believer would be an evil doer. Absolutely. It's against everything they believe. See, Roger's reading ahead in the handout here, too.

And for us, the victory, 1 Peter 3.16, having a good conscience that whereas they speak evil of you as evildoers, they may not be ashamed that falsely accuse your good conversation in Christ. They may be ashamed. They may be ashamed.

The next verse in 1 Peter 2.15 is a little bit more victorious, and that's going to be coming up in the next couple of weeks.

For so is the law of God that with well-doing may be put to silence the ignorance of foolish men. So keep doing evil, everyone, from the perspective of the world system around us. They may, by your good works which they observe, glorify God in the day of his attention. So there's this possibility that your good works may in fact bring fruit. And even though we were accused initially of being evildoers, ultimately that may ultimately be recognized as being made falsely accused of good and bring people to the Lord. I kind of put this in verbiage that I've often used with my children.

It's not what we do or not what you do, it's who we are. And when we live by faith in who we are, what we do is an evidence of who we are. It's not a matter of what we do, it's who we are. And when that plays out by faith, then ultimately God gets the glory. That doesn't mean there aren't trenches. envision the mountain peaks. Who we are.

That's the essence of evil doing, if in fact it's perceived as that. If who we are is in the Lord Jesus Christ, in the new nature energized by the Spirit, then it can be viewed as evil and that may ultimately pay dividends that are fruitful to bringing people to the Lord.

As Hal once said, Tom, you may be the only Bible someone will ever see. And Margaret reminds me of that frequently. Isn't that humbling? The fact that our lives walk by faith, even though initially we're called evildoers. Maybe the only Bible people ever see. Praise the Lord for that. And this brings glory to God. Glorify God, aorist, active, subjunctive.

That means it doesn't necessarily occur, but it might occur. So we can't say anything about our walk as to whether it's going to bring people to the Lord, or in fact whether it's going to uplift one another in biblical truth. But what we can say is it has a possibility that will, and we walk by faith.

Remember the Great Commission is often misinterpreted to say go around to the world and spread the gospel. No, the Great Commission is in your going, wherever you are, let the gospel be seen. And that's the concept of being the only Bible people ever see. And that's, again, these good tidings, if you will, that are viewed by the others as bringing glory to God.

Now, here's an interesting place to end this lesson this morning. In the day of visitation. So the question to the class, is this really a day? They're looking at the handout now. Roger, we've got to quit giving the handout before the time. So what do you think, is this a day, a specific day? Now I have to admit that Joanne probably knew this before she looked at the handout.

Visitation means to observe, inspect, or oversee and she's absolutely correct. So if you look at the two potential interpretations of this, and here they are, let's discuss this, we've got a few minutes yet. Here relates to how the good works of the believer as witnessed by the unsaved will bring some to salvation. That could be one interpretation. So the overseer is the one who's overseeing these, if you will, the good works, we'll use that term loosely, because the believer is being called to be a witness to the unsaved world. Constable, however, states that the day of visitation Notice he says probably, this is a quote from Constable. It's probably a reference to the day God will visit unbelievers and judge them, i.e. the great white throne judgment. People's thoughts on this. Roy, do you have a thought on this? The throne judgment there is a judgment of rewards for believers.

So when we think of that, it isn't It isn't that the unbelievers will be there as the believers. If we're dealing with a day of visitation from the unbelievers perspective, he's going to stand before God and his works will condemn him. But he will still glorify God in that day because he now remembers the believers and the work of God in them. That's the perspective I would say. will still acknowledge God's goodness, his glory at the day of judgment. Why? Because they have seen his glory in the believers. What are the letters of God? Okay. Tom.

It doesn't have to be restricted to just that view, although it's a pretty compelling one. We may not get raptured today and we may not get raptured at all until we are already alive to Christ in the Spirit after dying physically. But in the meantime, people with the convicting power of the Holy Spirit still present outside of us there in the world. see that there's something that happened here and now it's gone, but it's not because we did anything, it's because God did something. And it may catch your attention more than anything we ever said or did in our whole lives.

Alright, so that interpretation is more consistent with the first description here, would you agree? Yeah. Jeremy? Yeah, I think what Roy said is definitely applicable here, but It seems like Peter throughout the book, Peter's emphasis is on the present. We're looking forward to the future.

But our examples in the present, he says, as they observe them or while they observe them. So there's a sense of present tense. So I would lean more towards and he talks later when he's talking to wives with unsafe husbands, he says. believe me, it's not in this passage. But it's the idea that in 1 Peter 3, verse 1, he said, well, wives be submissive to your husbands, so that they may be won without a word by the behavior of their wives.

So he returns to this theme that in the present, people may, because of our reaction to persecution, unjust persecution, that they may glorify God. I think definitely a sense in 1 Peter of us looking forward to the day of the Lord, where he is going to return and finally execute justice on the earth. And it's true, as Roy pointed out, at the name of Jesus, every knee shall bow. So everyone's going to glorify God one day, whether they want to or not.

They're going to have no choice, I guess. But I think there's very much a present tense emphasis that Peter has in mind in this passage. The reason I'm walking around is to see if the questions can be heard better by people listening to the tapes. It's just, I think, a better way to do this. Other thoughts on this? I think the interpretation of the verb really does fit with what's happening now and not something too distant. But nevertheless, there's another view of the interpretation here. It's the idea that ultimately disperse as we play it out further.

Let's go back here. having your conduct honorable among the gentiles, when they speak against you as evildoers, they may by your good works, which they observe, glorify God in the day of visitation." That could be today. The day of visitation would be the day, in fact, they come to a saving relationship by what they've observed. I think that's probably most relevant here. By the way, what's our view? Once we're to the Lord, raptured or in fact, if we in fact go to be with him earlier and that's simply because of death? Are our works going to be dealt with there? Is it going to be punitive? Boy, how's teaching on, I think it's 1 Corinthians 10, is it that important? Is this dealt with or is it 5? Anyway, 1 Corinthians is really outstanding teaching.

And there's, I mean, wood, hay, stubble is not going to be dealt with. I like what Mike Doyle said about when we reach the Lord's presence, there may be different rewards that are potentially given, but everybody's going to be happy there. The Great White Throne doesn't really relate to us in terms of anything punitive for sure. Other thoughts on today's verses? There's a lot here. You'll make me get some physical activity, this is good.

Talking about verse 11, and our abstaining from our fleshly lust, I think we have to think of that in terms of how we're being persecuted. It is clear throughout the New Testament that we are going to be persecuted. That we are going to suffer trials and tribulations from the world. And so when we talk about our fleshly lust, I think it's Reading through 1 Peter in particular, I think we have to think deeply about how we react to all these things that go on, and whether or not we're reacting in a fleshly manner or a spiritual manner.

You can point to so many things. You mentioned Kenya and all the stuff going on in the Middle East. In America today, it seems like a lot of Christians want to make up persecution when it's not there, although there are examples where women persecute. And I think we have to look at, I think we have to think deeply about how our understanding of what Christ has promised us in terms of tribulation, how that affects our political views and what we're expecting out of government. And I don't know. I think there are a lot of Christians that don't react enough.

I wonder if they're reacting in a fleshly manner or a spiritual manner. But I think the thing we have to really look at is Given the fact that we are going to be considered evil doers by the world system, how are we going to react to that? What is our response going to be? Verse 12 speaks to that, how we should react, right? Exactly. And it's a conduct that's honorable. That's what we're called to.

And I bet your flesh, my flesh ain't capable of that. I could put it on as a charade for a short time in the flesh, but that's why I caution everyone not to look at behavior is ultimately the bottom line of where people are coming from. In the believer, we can see the nature of the Lord Jesus Christ lived out because we share faith. We know the flesh is capable of anything. Back to the example I gave from my colleague at NYU. The flesh can disappoint. We're all capable of performing that way, but we're called to a higher life.

As Romans 6.11-13 pointed out, that life is reckoning what's true. that we've been buried, we're risen in newness of life. He is risen today, he's risen indeed, but we're risen with him. So we've come to Holly Hills because we share the importance of the identification truths. It's not what we do for God, it's what he does for us, and everything is an act of faith by God's grace.

Any other thoughts here about today's lesson? Okay, Roger is up next week. What verses are you covering next week? The first part of, we're going to get into basically submission. Favorite, interesting topic. Submission, right. To the state first of all, that's going to be interesting. Okay, good.

Let's close in prayer. Roger, will you close us please? Dear Heavenly Father, we thank you so much, Lord. We thank you for this day, for the blessings we have in our Savior. Thank you for this special day to remember, again, He's risen indeed. We ask in His name, Amen. Amen.